Episode: 352 - Why Most People Stay Financially Stuck
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You know what you should be doing with your money—but something just keeps getting in the way. You’ve downloaded the templates, read the blogs, maybe even binged a few YouTube videos. Still, nothing’s really changing. Sound familiar?
You’re not alone. On this episode of the Debt Free Dad Podcast, Brad, Kati, Chris, and Ryan dig into the real reasons people stay stuck in debt—and it’s not because they don’t know better. It’s because behavior change is hard.
The Knowledge Trap
Brad kicks off the episode by calling out the elephant in the room: in today's world, access to information isn’t the issue. Most people already know what to do. But knowing doesn’t automatically translate into doing. For many, the challenge lies in changing deep-rooted habits and navigating the discomfort of doing things differently.
Why Simplicity Wins
Chris shares how overcomplicating his plan actually delayed his success. He believed doing things “right” meant following a perfect, complex system. But in reality? Simplicity is what worked. “Keep it simple, but do it consistently,” he says.
The Comfort of Misery
Ryan draws a brilliant parallel between managing his plantar fasciitis and managing money. “The doctor told me what to do, but I didn’t want to do it. I just wanted the result.” Sound familiar? When things aren’t “bad enough,” it’s easy to stay in familiar discomfort rather than push into the unknown.
Accountability Changes Everything
Kati shares that before joining Roots, she had already paid off $22,000 in debt. But it was joining the community that truly accelerated her results. Why? Because she finally had support and accountability. She wasn’t doing it alone anymore—and that made all the difference.
Brad backs this up with research: when people have regular accountability meetings, their likelihood of hitting their goal jumps from 65% to a staggering 95%.
It’s Not About Being Perfect
There’s no shame in falling off the wagon. Kati reminds us that even after seven years, she still has setbacks. What matters is getting back up. Celebrating small wins like skipping groceries and eating from the pantry can be just as empowering as paying off a chunk of debt.
You’re Not Alone
Ryan and Chris bring it home by reminding listeners that who you spend time with matters. If you’re serious about changing your finances, you need to surround yourself with people who support that change. You may lose a few invites, but you’ll gain your freedom—and maybe even inspire others in the process.
Key Takeaways:
- Knowledge is only the beginning—action and accountability are what drive change.
- Getting uncomfortable is part of the process. You won’t be perfect, but you will get better.
- Surrounding yourself with like-minded people can make the difference between staying stuck and breaking free.
- Progress isn’t just about what you pay off. It’s about what you choose not to do, too.
Feeling stuck? You don’t have to do this alone. That’s what the Debt Free Dad community is here for.
Resources Mentioned
The Totally Awesome Debt Freedom Planner https://www.debtfreedad.com/planner
To learn how to take the stress out of your finances so you can breathe again, follow this link: https://www.debtfreedad.com/lwp-masterclass-opt-in-page-podcast
Connect With Brad
Website- https://www.debtfreedad.com
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/thedebtfreedad
Private Facebook Group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/debtfreedad
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/debtfreedad/
TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@debt_free_dad
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@bradnelson-debtfreedad2751/featured
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Transcript
Brad Nelson:
All right, so you've read all the books, you've watched the YouTube videos, you've downloaded the budget templates, but why does it still feel like nothing is really changing for you? Now, if you've ever thought I know what I should be doing with my money, I just can't seem to do it. Well, this episode is going to be perfect for you. Today, we're going to be diving into the real reason most people stay stuck and spoiler alert it's not a lack of information. It's all about behavior, habits and really the stuff that happens between your ears, and once you understand what's really holding you back, you can finally get out of your own way. So let's break it down.
Announcer:
You're listening to the Debt-Free Dad Podcast with Brad Nelson. Brad and his co-hosts experience the anxiety of living paycheck to paycheck before learning the fundamentals of financial success. They are now on a mission to empower regular people to pay off their debt for good and enjoy happier, less stressful lives. Keep listening for inspirational interviews, tips, tricks and practical advice to gain financial freedom.
Brad Nelson:
Hey guys, welcome to gain financial freedom. Hey guys, welcome to today's show. My name is Brad Nelson. I'm the founder of Debt-Free Debt. I paid off about $45,000 in debt. I've been debt-free now for more than 12 years and I've also been fortunate to help thousands of other people save and pay off tens of millions of dollars with the work that we do here at Debt-Free Debt.
Chris Hawkins:
And my name is Chris Hawkins, and my wife and I started our journey way back 20 years ago, almost 2005. And we have been debt-free since 2008.
Kati Hatfield:
And I'm Katie Hatfield and I am still on my journey to debt freedom, but in the last almost seven years I have paid off $222,604 in debt on a single income.
Ryan Nelson:
And my name is Ryan Nelson. My wife and I paid off about $160,000 over eight years while we were raising three kids. Katie, did you?
Brad Nelson:
say $202,000?.
Kati Hatfield:
Two, two, two $222,000.
Brad Nelson:
What happened over the last I mean, it was at like below $2,000 for a while Did you, I mean $200,000,.
Kati Hatfield:
Yeah, I have been working really hard. Let's see my annual bonus tax refund. I've just been plugging away.
Brad Nelson:
Dang getting after it.
Chris Hawkins:
I love that Every time I hear her give the number. It keeps going up I know.
Kati Hatfield:
Listen, I hate to say this, but I'm like what the hell did she buy to go that much right? Well, let's see, there are a couple of medical bills, two college student loans, um bunch of credit cards, uh, several cars that I had negative equity that I rolled over.
Brad Nelson:
It's just a lot of poor decisions and behaviors which is what we're going to be focusing on today. And, guys, after listening to this episode, if you guys want to take things to the next level, if you're ready to break free from living paycheck to paycheck, you would like to be like Katie, paying off $200,000 plus. You want to reduce financial stress, build your savings, finally pay off debt for good. But, again, maybe you're not sure where exactly to start. We've created some incredible free resources here at Debt Free Dad to help you get there, and we'll be sharing some details about some of those later on in today's episode.
Brad Nelson:
So, as I mentioned, we're talking about how to get on stock with your finances, and a lot of people tend to focus on just learning education right, and not that that's a bad thing. Education is important. We've all had to start there and figure this out, but I think in today's day and age, with the internet, especially with the popularity now and the growing popularity of AI and all of that information isn't really the problem, and I would really like to hit on what you guys feel about this, because we all had to learn something about this to get out of debt, but I can pretty much guarantee that all of us it wasn't really the education. That was the real issue. It was doing it. That was really the hard part, right.
Kati Hatfield:
Absolutely, I would say. For me it was definitely the behaviors I read Dave Ramsey I got out of. Let's see, I paid off $22,000 before I ever joined Roots on my own, but my problem was I was still charging to my credit cards and so you have to stop digging the hole so you can finally get out of the hole. That was definitely something, but I knew all the things, but I had to learn something new and have the accountability that your program provides. That definitely was the switch that had to flip in my brain.
Chris Hawkins:
For me, it was overcomplicating things a couple of times, almost too much information, trying to be too sophisticated, thinking that if I did everything X, y and Z perfectly, then it should be really simple. And it is simple, but it's hard. If that makes sense, okay, but for me it was overcomplicating things and I had to learn that I'm not the only one and that you are going to get stuck. Nobody's going to go through this perfectly. I did a podcast episode, I think, last year the financial roadmap that everybody's going to go through, and I talked about this a lot. There are going to be times where you go back to step number one and you have to be willing to keep trying I think that's a big part of it and learn from your own mistakes. And eventually it took me twice to learn that, hey, maybe I shouldn't overcomplicate things, Keep it simple, and it makes it a lot easier.
Ryan Nelson:
I think this episode applies to life. So I've been suffering just I'll give you kind of a personal story. I've been suffering with plantar fasciitis for a couple of years and so a few months ago I finally went to the doctor. I'm like, okay, I've had enough, I'm going to go to the doctor. He gave me all the information. There's everything you need to do, and if you do all these things, it'll get better.
Ryan Nelson:
I don't want to do it, and I think that that's the reality for a lot of people. Now I started to do it and guess what happened? It started to get better, but that first month and a half or whatever and it was the same way with debt. I wanted to get better with my debt, but I didn't want to do the work. I don't want to do what's necessary to get better in my finances, or and you just kind of take this and you can really apply this to a lot of your areas in your life it's like a lot of people want to do the thing that they want.
Ryan Nelson:
It's like this is the goal, this is where I want to get to, but then when you show them all the crap they got to do to get there, I don't want to do all that, I just want to get there. You know they want the magic pill. I want the magic pill. It's going to make my feet feel better. Because he said, well, we can give you a shot. And I've been denying it because I know if he gives me the shot, it's going to make me think it feels better and I'm definitely not going to do the work. So it's like I've been avoiding to get that. So I just think this is just a good episode, not just for your finances, but for anything in your life. You know, if you want something, you got to be willing to do all the crap that nobody's willing to do to get there.
Brad Nelson:
Yeah, you know there was two things that really kept me stuck from getting started as number one and this is still even applicable today is that I hate stinking and sucking at things. I just hate it. Like when you start anything new, you're not good at any of it. You're kind of dumb yeah, you don't, you're just not good at it and I hate that feeling. I hate it. But the only way to really get good at it is, unfortunately, you got to start right. I think that's what kept me stuck for a while is that I just I didn't want to suck at it. I find myself stuck at some of those things even today, at 45 years old. You know that I just don't want to have that feeling that I'm not good at something. The other one is too.
Brad Nelson:
It was a habit thing, even though it was painful, my stress was high, I had no savings, my financial life was terrible, but it was familiar. I hate to use the word comfortable, but it was. It's what I've known, it's what I've always known, and I think just that familiarity and just being comfortable also can keep you stuck. And I use this analogy. Nobody really likes it, but I like it. It's like a kid or like a baby in their poopy diaper, right, they don't want to be changed, they'd rather just sit in it sometimes, right, and that's what I feel like. I was feeling like when I had a really bad financial situation. I just was comfortable. I didn't want to get out of it.
Chris Hawkins:
Yeah, in the book, the one thing they talk about why comfortable, even though it may not be good for you, comfortable is comfortable, and the analogy he uses in there is we all have a meal. The analogy he uses in there is we all have a meal, some meal that you know how to cook real easy, real quick. That's your go-to meal when you're short on time or you're in a hurry or you just don't want to spend a lot of time cooking. There's that one thing that you go to. Why? Because it's the most comfortable thing. It's the thing that you know the most. And I think you're right, brad, even though you know you need to make some changes. It's the unknown that makes you uncomfortable. At least you know how bad it is, or you think you know how bad it is, and it's weird how sometimes that's the comfortable position that you'll stay in, versus trying something different.
Kati Hatfield:
You can't stretch and grow if you don't at least try to leave your comfort zone a little bit.
Ryan Nelson:
Yeah, I think the one challenge with it, though, especially for us we never were to the point where we couldn't afford the bills. It was tight. There were weeks and months where we only had $20 or $30 left in the checking account, but there was never a point where we really hit a point where we couldn't afford anything. So, going back to what you said, brad, is it's easy to stay there because it's familiar.
Ryan Nelson:
I, technically, am affording everything. Yeah, it's stressful, but I'd rather not change it. I'd rather keep doing what I'm doing than to kind of like what you said stink at something new, try something new, get out of your comfort zone, especially when you can afford. When you can afford things, it's easier to change, because now it's like something's got to change. We got to change something now Because we are in a in a spot, but it's in. It's to a lot of those people where you're just that monthly grind of paycheck to paycheck yeah, you're affording life, but it's a lot of stress, a lot of misery. I think it's a lot easier to like go back to old habits and just keep doing what you're doing because, technically, you're not hitting rock bottom yet.
Brad Nelson:
Yeah, yeah, I've heard that before where they say you know self-development people or any lot of books that you'll read, they'll say we're doing okay, is one of the most dangerous places that you can be, because you get complacent and you do, you get comfortable and you don't want to make any changes. And I would be willing to bet a lot of the people that we work with, especially here at Deferredad, are probably some of those individuals. And then what ends up happening is a life event happens and all of a sudden we're doing okay All of a sudden turns into now it's a crisis, I lost my job, I was sick, I lost income, I got behind on bills. They're basically just getting by enough and then all of a sudden something happens where it triggers them to want to make a change.
Brad Nelson:
The other thing I want to do, too, is hit on where Katie was talking earlier, when she was mentioning that she's paid off over $222,000 in debt. Katie, you had mentioned support and, when you joined Roots, how that really helped you. You paid $22,000 of debt off by yourself, but then you joined Deferredad and Roots and got inside of a community. So I'd like to hit on how that really, I guess, helped you push the gas pedal down a little bit more versus doing it on your own.
Kati Hatfield:
Well, when it was just me on my own, I was embarrassed. I didn't want to tell my friends or my family that, hey, I am not really sure if I'm going to pay rent or my credit card bill this month, because in my head, I had to pay the credit card bill, so my credit scores stayed nice and high which it wasn't even that high to begin with, because I was really bad at debt and so when I had accountability with other people in a community that have also gotten into debt and are trying to get out of debt and are just trying new, different ways of thinking and new behaviors, it was just so much easier to be like oh okay, so I'm not the only one struggling, I'm not the only one feeling all this pressure and like trying to keep appearances to everybody else, like it is hard work to keep that mask up.
Chris Hawkins:
So, speaking of that, I've done financial coaching, brad. You've done financial coaching, still doing it, obviously. But one thing that shocked me was the number of times that I heard people who would admit they had $60,000, $70,000, $100,000 worth of credit card debt. It happened more often than you think and, of course, as a financial coach, in the back of your mind it's like holy smokes, how does somebody do that? But then, the second time I heard it, the third time I heard it, the fourth time I heard it, it's like I began to expect it. And so, katie, I'm curious is when you got into Roots, did you find that there were other people who had large amounts of debt like yourself? And I don't want to say it made you feel comfortable, but made you see that this is doable and you're not alone.
Kati Hatfield:
Yes, and when I saw other people, they're like I have $10,000 in debt, I'm like that's like nothing. You should be over this in like no time. But I also had to think okay, I've got a lot in front of me. When I wrote that number down, it was literally made me sick to my stomach of how much debt was accumulated. Plus it was accumulating interest on top of that. So even though I was making the minimum payments on everything, that gets you nowhere. I had to really figure out where to put more money or get more money, like taking on gig jobs or a second job to have more income, because I only made so much at my day job, so I had to sell stuff and you just have to come up with other ways. You have to be creative. So, like what was not working, I had to change.
Chris Hawkins:
So by being in the group that helped you realize that you're not alone, Is that correct?
Kati Hatfield:
Yes, absolutely. There were running buddies. Like I had a couple of gals at the time that I just looked up to them like, okay, they have this much and they're getting it done. So like I don't feel quite so on my own.
Brad Nelson:
Yeah Well, it makes a huge difference and people will often ask they'll say, how are these people able to do this? And this is the answer you guys, it is just the power of accountability. That is it Support and accountability. Like Katie, you probably weren't doing anything massively different when you did it on your own versus doing it in the group, but you had that accountability and support. So it keeps your feet to the fire, it keeps you accountable, it keeps you doing it when you're on your own.
Brad Nelson:
You can be very loosey-goosey because we are terrible accountability partners to ourselves, and this is a stat we often share in our Life Without Payments workshop that we do about every three months or so. But the American Society of Training and Development actually did a study on accountability. They found that people are 65% more likely to reach a goal in whatever goal they have in their life with an accountability partner. But if they have an ongoing accountability meeting meaning they have to show up to a meeting where someone's going to hold them accountable for doing the actions that they said that they were going to do that number jumps up to 95% likelihood that they're going to complete that goal. So at the end of the day, it's not about always just trying harder. It's really about getting yourself the right support and environment.
Brad Nelson:
And we see that all the time in Roots Heck. If you guys listen to some of our Roots members who come on this podcast and they share what they've done, many of them actually all of them say I never would have believed I could pay off this much debt. But the real secret is just that they had support and accountability. We held their feet to the fire. We told them like hey, you said you're going to do this, let's do it. And they're doing it now and that's it.
Kati Hatfield:
It's just consistency, discipline and just doing it day in and day out and also it's not a judgmental environment because you're not saying, oh, you didn't do what you said you were going to do last week. Life happens and things come up, but it's just that reminder like, hey, we're here for you. If you know you fell off the wagon for a week or a month or whatever. You, you know what to do. Just get back on, brush yourself off, get back on the right track and it's okay.
Kati Hatfield:
I have fallen off and gotten off track more times than I can count in the last seven years. You know what the right thing is. You just have to sometimes stop yourself and go okay, put the money back. Don't hit submit on that online order. Do you really need this? Is it just a want? Is it an impulse? It's just making different decisions and then celebrating the wins. This week, I have not gone grocery shopping and I've just eaten what's in my fridge and my pantry. Sometimes those are the wins. It doesn't even just have to be. I've paid off so much in debt. It's what didn't I do to save myself that money?
Brad Nelson:
Right. Well, it kind of goes back to what Chris said, too, about you didn't feel alone. If you think about when you started anything new, think about when you started your first day of freshman year of high school. That's a scary time, but you also have a bunch of other kids that are also starting new as well. Like, there's camaraderie there, there's connection. You guys have something in common, right? Or even, let's say, you start a new job and there's multiple new people that are starting. You're all going through training together. It feels less overwhelming when you have people around you in the same position as you are, versus you having to do everything by yourself and you're the new person, right. I think that makes just a huge difference, especially when you're talking about something as sensitive as finances, where there's a lot of shame and embarrassment and people feel somewhat dumb that they don't know what they're supposed to be doing or they don't have all their stuff figured out. Those emotions can really keep you stuck as well.
Ryan Nelson:
You are what you hang around, and I think, when it comes to support and accountability, I mean, if you want to just test this, go to your family and friends tomorrow and tell them all that you want to get out of debt and then report back and let us know what they say. I guarantee you most of them are going to laugh call you crazy. I called my brother crazy for doing it. It's just a natural reaction. No-transcript to the mall and go do all these things. There's a high chance that you are going to just follow them and you're going to maybe make some progress for a month or two and you'll go right back to doing what you're doing and then you'll try it again and you'll never do anything. You've got to get around people consistently that are trying to do this and you will start to adopt that mindset and start to think differently and start saying no to your friends will be easier than it is right now.
Brad Nelson:
Yeah, yeah, I mean I lost. I wouldn't say I lost, but obviously relationships weakened when I got out of debt. It just, but obviously relationships weakened when I got out of debt. They just did.
Brad Nelson:
Because it was very similar to what you just said, right, some of the people I was hanging out with it was causing me to spend money that I didn't have and I couldn't keep up anymore. So, either I had to make a choice, like, if I want to do this, I can't keep doing this stuff anymore, and so I had to start saying no a lot. And because I said no a lot, guess what I? I got less and less invited to a lot of those things and, over time, those relationships, they just didn't stay like they were. But honestly, at the end of the day I didn't really lose out too much. But that's something you do need to think about. You do have to take a stand for your financial life and say this just doesn't align with my financial goals anymore, and sometimes relationships might suffer, but at the end of the day, I think you're going to look back and say it was worth it.
Ryan Nelson:
And you'll be surprised at some of those people that will come back and say you know, hey, can you help, can you help me? Because we had that happen. We did it and we had some people that we've had friends and family that started asking like, how did you do it? And now you're kind of starting to pay it forward to other people who also thought you were crazy at first Like again my brother who I thought he was crazy and then after a while it's like, oh, this kind of works, because at first it's just so foreign. You're like this is just it's not going to work. But when you start seeing it work, then you just have a mindset shift.
Chris Hawkins:
The important thing is to open up. You've got to be willing to put it all out there, and oftentimes to a new group, somebody different, and that's temporarily. Like Ryan said, you may lose some friends or some family temporarily, but you'd be surprised it's happened to me as well. How many people come back later and go hey, how did you do that? And people watch. They may not always say something, but the next thing you know they're following your lead, doing some of the very same things that you're doing or have done simply because of your actions.
Chris Hawkins:
And you have an opportunity to really influence a lot of other people when you make it through it. But that does mean opening up to a new group of people and sharing information. That can be shameful and make you feel like you're terrible, but you're not. You're normal, You're average. And if you want to go and be great and get out of debt and do the same things that we're able to do, finding a group, an accountability group, will go a long way and then I think in the long run you're going to find that you influence a lot of people that you didn't realize that you were doing so.
Kati Hatfield:
And I think we just want to point out in case you are new to the podcast Ryan is Brad's brother, so if you didn't catch that relation he's talking about. Thank, you. Thank you.
Brad Nelson:
All right, guys, if you're ready to break free from living paycheck to paycheck, you want to reduce financial stress, build savings and finally pay off debt for good. But again, maybe you're not sure where to get started. Maybe you feel stuck, just like we talked about in today's episode. Don't worry, we've got you covered. Simplify my Money is sent to you each and every Sunday, to your email, and it's going to be your step-by-step roadmap to better financial control. You're also going to learn some easy to follow strategies to manage your money more effectively stress-free money decisions that are going to help you simplify your financial life with proven tips that actually work for normal people, and you're going to gain the tools and confidence to tackle your financial goals head on. You can sign up for Simplify my Money by clicking the link at the top of the show notes.
Chris Hawkins:
Let's talk about that baby, let's talk about your money. Let's talk about all the good things, all the bad things that may be. Let's talk about that. Let's talk about that. Tune into Dead, free Dance Tune into Dead Free Dance.
Brad Nelson:
All right, guys. That sound means it's time for the celebrations of the show, and today we're kicking off with Lauren. Lauren says today I went into one of my favorite stores just to see what they had. I went up and down the aisles never feeling the need to purchase anything, happy to have walked out empty handed and no purchase. Regrets Lauren man, you are testing your behavior on that. One Great job, great win, awesome. And Mary says you are testing your behavior on that. One Great job, great win, awesome.
Chris Hawkins:
And Mary says this is the month of no N-O. No, she's got several things going on, so there's no room to add anything new.
Brad Nelson:
Yeah, no is a complete sentence. I like that Way to go, mary.
Kati Hatfield:
And Vanessa definitely separating her financial planning from her everyday planning has helped so much. She loves paper planners, but having all of it together was just not working. So the debt free dad planner is much more involved than just a bill, name and amount on a calendar. So glad she bought it. It is a game changer for sure. I have that and I have been using it for years and it is awesome.
Brad Nelson:
All right, guys. As always, congratulations to all of you guys who are taking a stand for your financial life and you're wanting better. Hey, we get that. Getting out of debt isn't easy, but with our help and with your consistency and discipline, we promise you guys, this will be some of the best work that you guys do in your entire life. Thanks for joining us on today's show and we will see you guys on the next episode.
Announcer:
Thanks for listening to the Debt-Free Dad podcast. Connect with us on Facebook, tiktok, youtube and Instagram. Just search Debt-Free Dad. If you found value in today's episode, please leave us a rating and review. We so appreciate it. For resources, show notes and links mentioned in today's show visit debtfreedadcom. Catch you next week.
